Why I don’t take vitamin D supplements / Getting Stronger
Tags: 25-D, adaptive immune system, corticosteroids, David Agus, deficiency, homeostasis, hormones, inflammation, Mark Sisson, Paul Albert, receptors, supplements, Trevor Marshall, VDR, vitamin D
Posted 11 Nov 2012 in Uncategorized
Vitamin D has been associated with numerous health benefits, including cardiovascular and immune health, bone strength, and prevention of cancer. However, studies claim that most of us are deficient in vitamin D, and thereby unnecessarily vulnerable to increased heart disease, stroke, cancer, diabetes, osteoporosis, infection and autoimmune disorders. According to a review of recent studies in Natural News, there is a woldwide epidemic of vitamin D deficiency: 59% of the population is “vitamin D deficient”. The article goes onto to speculate that “What’s becoming increasingly clear from all the new research is that vitamin D deficiency may be the common denominator behind our most devastating modern degenerative diseases.”
Supplementation with vitamin D capsules is advocated even by “primal” advocate Mark Sisson, normally one to take inspiration from our paleolithic ancestors, shunning medication and embracing a lifestyle of eating whole foods and engaging in moderately stressful, playful exercise:
We can’t all bask in the midday sun.. For those of us unable to run shirtless and shoeless through a sun kissed meadow…our option is oral intake… food will help, but it won’t suffice. You need something stronger. ..take a good D3 supplement if you can’t get real sunlight. As long as you don’t go overboard on the dosage, you’re good to go. If it’s not in an oil-based capsule, just take it with a bit of fatty food (not a stretch for an Primal eater). It travels the same pathway and results in the same benefits. It’s always easier to just let nature take its course, but it’s not always realistic. A good general rule is 4000 IU per day.Therefore, we should supplement with vitamin D. Right?
Not so fast. A closer examination shows that low vitamin D levels may be a consequence, not a cause, of poor health. And that supplementation with Vitamin D may actually be counterproductive. Let me explain.
Homeostatic regulation. First, I’d like to return briefly to a previous post I wrote. In The case against antioxidants, I presented evidence that supplementation with antioxidants is not only unhelpful, but may actually be counterproductive. In my article, I surveyed several meta-analyses of the antioxidant vitamins A, C, and E — demonstrating a lack of benefit from supplementation, and in some cases positive harm. At first, this result surprised me. How can one explain it? After all, we know that vitamin-rich fruits, vegetables and herbs are good for us. Extracts from these anti-oxidant-rich foods have been shown to neutralize reactive oxygen species (ROS) in the lab. Hence, it must be the case that fruits, vegetables and herbs are good for us because of their antioxidant content – right?
Wrong. As we all know, correlation does not always imply causation. And it turns out that fruits, vegetables and nuts may improve our resistance to oxidative damage for reasons other than their antioxidant content.
A more likely reason is that these foods are rich in polyphenolic phytochemicals–such as bioflavanoids– that stimulate the cells in our bodies to turn on a transcription factor called Nrf2, which activates our “xenobiotic” defense system. This xenobiotic defense system or Antioxdiant Response Element turns on the production of a number of endogenous anti-oxidant enzymes–such as superoxide dismutase and glutathione peroxidase–that inactivate ROS species catalytically. That means that unlike the antioxidant chemicals in foods–which quickly get used up one-for-one when neutralizating oxidant molecules–the anti-oxidant enzymes turn over thousands of times, and are thus far more potent and sustainable defenses. In addition, these enzymes are produced in cells throughout the body, localized where they are needed most.
In short, empowering our in-born antioxidant defense system is much more effective than supplementing with chemical antioxidants.
But what is even more startling is that supplementing with endogenous antioxidants can actually suppress your body’s endogenous ARE defense system. Startling, but not too surprising once you realize that the ARE system is homeostatically regulated. That means that your metabolism compensates for external changes by making the appropriate internal changes in order to restore a rough balance. Just as body temperature, blood glucose, and countless other internal variables are regulated, our defenses against oxidative stress are regulated.
Homeostatic regulation, ubiquitous in biology, evolved to help us adjust to changing circumstances, and to conserve resources. If antioxidants are supplied from the outside, there is less need to spend energy and internal resources making our own anti-oxidant enzymes, so the organism turns town their production. In my earlier article, I surveyed studies showing that this is just what happens, concluding:
So it appears that, by consuming more antioxidants, we become dependent upon them and perversely reduce our innate ability to detoxify. With any let-up in the constant supply of external defenses, we become more vulnerable to oxidative and inflammatory attack. And the externally supplied antioxidants themselves are in any case much less effective than the endogenous ones.I ended by recommending that we select foods and herbs not for their anti-oxidant content, but rather for their hormetic ability to stimulate our native ability to produce’s its own detoxifying antioxidant enzymes. At the top of that list are brightly colored and bitter foods and herbs, such as broccoli, blueberries, red peppers, curcumin, green tea and even chocolate.
The moral of the story: When possible, build your own capacity rather than relying on external supplies.
Now on to vitamin D. Not everyone realizes that this “vitamin” is actually a hormone — a secosteroid in the same family as other steroid hormones like testosterone and cortisol. As a hormone, the primary function of vitamin D is to regulate levels of calcium and phosphorus in the bloodstream, thereby promoting healthy bone formation. But vitamin D also regulates a number of other important processes in the body, such as activation of both the innate immune system and the adaptive immune system.
The diet can supply vitamin D as either D2 (ergocalciferol, from plants) or D3 (cholescalciferol, from animals), but it is most effectively synthesized in the skin by the action of UV-B rays in sunlight acting on 7-dehydroxycholesterol. (Yes, it all starts with cholesterol!). But neither D2 nor D3 — the molecules present in supplements or food — are biologically active forms of the vitamin. The diagram at right shows how vitamin D must first be converted by hydroxylation to calcidiol (usually designated as 25 (OH) D, or just “25-D”) in the liver and then further hydroxyulated to calcitriol (1,25 (OH)2 D or just “1,25-D”) in the kidney. It is the 1,25-D form that is biologically active, binding to the vitamin D receptor (VDR) and activating a cascade of important biological functions, such as calcium absorption in the intestines. So a well-functioning liver and kidney are required in order for vitamin D to be effective.
Vitamin D studies. Nobody doubts the important role of vitamin D in the body. But are higher levels of a hormone like vitamin D–whether or not provided as a supplement– always a good thing? Well, that is far from clear. In a review of vitamin D studies in The End of Illness, David Agus, professor of medicine at University of Southern California, cites both positive and negative consequences of increased vitamin D levels. On the positive side, a 2009 study presented by the Intermountain Medical Center in Utah, following 27,686 men older than 50 years over the course of a decade, found that those with the lowest levels of vitamin D had:
- 90% higher incidence of heart failure
- 81% higher incidence of heart attack
- 51% higher incidence of stroke
- A 2010 double-blind, placebo-controlled study, published in the Journal of the American Medical Association, found that older women who received annual oral high-dose vitamin D had an increased risk for falls and fractures.
- A 2008 study, published in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute, found that vitamin D does not reduce the risk of prostate cancer, and furthermore that higher circulating levels of 25-hydroxyvitamin D may be associated with an increased risk of more aggressive forms of prostate cancer.
So how do we interpret these associations? As Agus points out, in regard to the Utah study:
An association, however, does not prove cause and effect. Another way of looking at this study is to say it’s quite possible that a heart condition lowers vitamin D levels, directly or indirectly— by keeping people with health challenges indoors and out of the sun. Also, obesity throws another wrench into the problem because excess fat absorbs and holds on to vitamin D so that it cannot be properly used in the body. Hence, is low vitamin D in this study just a marker for those who were obese? It’s the old chicken-and-egg conundrum. The same can be said for hundreds of other such studies that link the health (or lack thereof) of an individual to levels of vitamin D.This is the key point: Low vitamin D levels may be a biomarker for other problems. It may be the consequence, rather than the cause, of certain conditions such as heart disease or obesity. For the same reason, high vitamin D levels may be a biomarker for good health. Agus quotes Dr. JoAn Manson, chief of preventive medicine at Brigham and Women’s Hospital:
People may have high vitamin D levels because they exercise a lot and are getting ultraviolet-light exposure from exercising outdoors. Or they may have high vitamin D because they are health conscious and take supplements. But they also have a healthy diet, don’t smoke, and do a lot of the other things that keep you healthy.If vitamin D level in the blood is merely a biomarker, a consequence of good or bad health, then adding vitamin D to the diet will not necessarily improve your health. To really know whether vitamin D supplementation is beneficial, we need to look at interventional studies, where supplements are provided, and the outcomes are compared with those of control subjects who don’t get the supplement. In fact the two above-cited studies on the effects of supplementation on bone fractures in older women, and prostrate cancer in older men are two such interventional studies. And they showed that vitamin D supplementation was harmful in both cases. And note that the positive Utah study I cited above–showing a correlation between low vitamin D levels and elevated incidence of cardiovascular disease and stroke–was an observational study, not an interventional one.
The men in that study with the higher vitamin D blood levels and lower incidence of heart disease were not given supplements.
Vitamin D levels are homeostatically regulated in our bodies, and this process varies with your genetics and health. As one examlple of this, people with lighter skin color and less melanin in the skin evolved to make higher vitamin D levels even with reduced sun exposure; the converse is true of those with darker skin. (This may explain why African Americans are at much higher risk for vitamin D “deficiency”, particularly if they live in higher latitudes and work indoors). People vary widely in the level at which they regulate vitamin D levels in their blood — it tends to be homeostatically controlled in a given individual, but the “normal” level may vary between 8 and 80 ng/ml, or even more widely than that. Vitamin D levels are are genetically controlled by 3 or 4 genes, and are under control of the vitamin D receptor. (This homeostatic regulation of vitamin D levels will sound familiar to those who read my previous post, “Change your receptors, change your set point“). As Agus notes,
When your cells are deluged with vitamin D…they will pull back on their sensitivity to vitamin D by reducing their number of receptors for vitamin D. But if there’s a perceived shortfall of vitamin D in the bloodstream, your cells will up-regulate— create more receptors for vitamin D— to become more sensitive to every vitamin D molecule that passes by. What happens, then, when we consume lots of vitamin D from unnatural sources such as supplements? (I use the term unnatural to imply that it’s not coming from the sun, which is a source of vitamin D that has built-in regulatory mechanisms.) No doubt our bodies are adept at adjusting using their feedback loops as I just described, and the constant surplus of vitamin D means our cells are constantly down-regulating. If we took the supplemental vitamin D away, our cells would up-regulate to make up the difference. Vitamin D has multiple downstream signaling molecules, for the vitamin D receptor signals several reactions.So if you take vitamin D supplements, and vitamin D is regulated homeostatically, your body will turn down its endogenous production of vitamin D. If you believe that vitamin D is a “biomarker” of good health, do you really want to turn down the upstream processes that synthesize vitamin D? Think about that before you pop a vitamin D capsule.
Unintended consequences. Even worse, taking vitamin D supplements may actually suppress the immune system. This “alternative hypothesis” of vitamin D has been put forward by Trevor Marshall and Paul Albert. Supplementation with vitamin D will tend to increase levels of the inactive form of vitamin D–that is, 25-D. Conversion of inactive 25-D to active 1,25-D in the kidneys is not immediate, and may not be efficient, particular if kidney function is less than optimal. Now here is the problem: While both the inactive 25-D and active 1,25 bind to the vitamin D receptor (VDR), only the 1,25-D turns on the VDR, allowing it to perform its beneficial functions; the inactive 25-D actually inhibits the VDR. This is a problem because the VDR is the “gate-keeper” of the innate immune system, regulating over a thousand genes. So elevated levels of 25-D can result in immunosuppressive effects. As Albert writes in Vitamin D: The alternative hypothesis:
Indeed, the secosteroid 25-D may exert palliation on the innate immune system not unlike the way corticosteroids exert palliation on the adaptive immune system. So is it possible then that supplemental vitamin D is now perceived as a wonder substance simply because it effectively palliates the inflammation associated with diseases across the board? If so, this would certainly explain why its effects are most noticeable in the short-term and why efficacy often diminishes in the long-term.And we need to also take into account the regulation of vitamin D levels through homeostatic feedback processes. Consider that it is typically the 25-D form of vitamin D–not the biologically active 1,25-D– that is measured in blood tests. And there is very little correlation between the active and inactive forms, as shown in the the figure below, from a 2009 study by Blaney et al., published in the Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences in a sample of 100 Canadian patients. As the authors note, while many of the subjects had very low levels of 25-D–the type reported in most blood tests–most of them had levels of 1,25-D elevated above the normal range. Can those subjects with low levels of 25-D but elevated levels of the biologically active 1,25-D truly be considered vitamin D deficient?
Yet, the alternative hypothesis must be considered – that the low levels of 25-D observed in patients with chronic disease could just as easily be a result rather than a cause of the inflammatory disease process. Our research suggests that this is the case. Indeed we have found that 1,25-D tends to rise in patients with chronic disease and that these high levels of 1,25-D are able to downregulate through the PXR nuclear receptor the amount of pre-vitamin D converted into 25-D, leading to lower levels of 25-D. I describe this finding further in my paper. So are we really facing an epidemic of vitamin D “deficiencey” or are we simply beginning to note more signs of an imminent epidemic of chronic disease – an epidenmic which would be exacerbated by increasing the amount of vitamin D added to our food supply?So the body is making enough active vitamin D to deal with inflammation–maybe even too much, leading to downregulation of the inactive 25-D precursor. Trevor Marshall has also pointed out that elevated levels of 1,25-D may result from impaired activity of the VDR, which is essential for innate immunity. The excess 1,25-D can cause problems with other secosteroid receptors in the body, such as the thyroid receptor. But adding more 25-D, beyond what is needed, will tend to only further inhibit the VDR, interfering with its beneficial anti-inflammatory actions, and impairing innate immunity. In other words, well-intended supplementation with Vitamin D3 may actual backfire. Something to think about!
Marshall is currently conducting studies with a protocol involving restriction of vitamin D and use of an agonist drug that binds to the VDR receptor, upregulating it, and acting as an immuno-stimulant to treat immune disorders like arthritis and multiple sclerosis. Marshall’s protocol is controversial, because it flies in the face of the orthodoxy about Vitamin D. He acknowledges that vitamin D supplementation can indeed deliver some short term benefits because it acts as an immuno-suppressant–in much the same was as corticosteroids like prednisone. But just as prednisone is useful for acute treatments, yet is harmful if taken chronically, the immune-suppresant effects of vitamin D on the VDR may be detrimental.
One need not go to the extent of restricting or avoiding vitamin D to exercise some caution about actively supplementing it. If supplementation has risks, is there anything you can do to ensure adequate levels of the active form of vitamin D? Certainly, it is important to have at least an adequate level of D3 entering the liver, by eating foods rich in vitamin D, and through biosynthesis from adequate exposure to sunlight. But you also want to make sure that the conversion processes to 25-D in the liver and 1,25-D in the kidneys are functioning well. Which means eating a low-inflammatory diet — that is, one that is low in sugars, processed omega-6 vegetable oils and other pro-inflammatory compounds.
Here is the takeaway from this vitamin D story, together with my earlier post about antioxidants: Inflammatory conditions, such as heart disease, infection or autoimmune disease are often associated with reduced levels of certain biomarkers in the blood, such as antioxidant vitamins or hormones. Our natural instinct is to conclude that these are “deficiencies” that need to be corrected. While that may sometimes be the case, particularly in extreme cases, you should keep in mind the direct supplementation with additional vitamin or hormone may actually be counterproductive–by shutting down or impairing your body’s own ability to mount it’s own defense against oxidative stress and inflammation.
Rather than taking hormone and vitamin supplements, it is more effective to stimulate your body to strengthen its own defense and detoxification systems. I’m not against all supplementation — for example, I believe that ingestion of phytochemical-rich vegetables and herbs is useful as a hormetic stimulus. But I think we have to overcome the simplistic notion that if X is a good thing, we should consume more of X.
The body is more than a repository for chemicals — it is a self-regulating organism with hundreds of complex and dynamic feedback loops, evolved to enable us to adapt to changing circumstances and meet many challenges. We should take care that what we ingest is used to build up our natural capacities, not subvert them.
July 27, 2011 at 2:22 pm
July 27, 2011 at 2:31 pm
I always wonder when certain things bother me or not. The main thing I’ve noticed since goin primal is more energy and better digstion. Though I still have weird digestion sometimes but it’s hard to pinpoint what it is. Sometimes I think it’s when I have a lot of berries. I’ve told you before I’m nursing two kids so I don’t want to eliminate a bunch of stuff to figure it out cuz I gotta eat enough to make lots of milk.
Anyway that was a really interesting post. Thanks for sharing a week in the life
July 27, 2011 at 3:35 pm
July 27, 2011 at 2:45 pm
July 27, 2011 at 7:53 pm
July 27, 2011 at 2:51 pm
Knowing what you eat on a daily basis is SUPER helpful! Now I have some awesome guidelines on what to work on! Thanks so much!
July 27, 2011 at 2:52 pm
July 27, 2011 at 8:00 pm
July 27, 2011 at 3:04 pm
Through research and personal experience I have come to most of the same conclusions as you. I am mostly Paleo/Primal in my eating but am still working to nail down what foods are best for me personally. Your story is encouraging.
If you have not already come across it, Dr Natasha Campbell-McBride published a book “Gut and Psychology Syndrome” which, as the title indicates, provides a lot of explanation and support for the connection between our diet and our psychological states.
Cheers
July 27, 2011 at 3:21 pm
July 27, 2011 at 3:07 pm
I remember you saying that you can’t tolerate butter, but it looks like you eat non-fat yogurt with no problems – was it cow’s milk yogurt that you ate? I have Celiac Disease too, so I didn’t eat dairy for about a year, and have experimented with adding it back into my diet. High-fat dairy like butter and cream I can eat with no problems, but the low or non fat does not treat me well!
July 27, 2011 at 3:19 pm
July 27, 2011 at 3:18 pm
July 27, 2011 at 3:30 pm
July 27, 2011 at 4:23 pm
We started SAD then went more WAPF and now are moving more Primal. I feel better with no grains. But still have lots of cravings and give in more than I should. (I’m also nursing right now and that has to have something to do with it all.)
Have you every heard of the GAPS diet? It uses lots of bone broth and fermented foods and is supposed to heal food allergies and gut issues. We’re working towards that, but it’s very restrictive…which you are already good at. LOL
Do you have reactions with ghee? I’ve read that most people who can’t have butter do fine with it.
Why do you only eat the non-fat yogurt? I’ve read so much about why it’s bad and why whole milk (preferably raw) yogurt is best. I was just wondering your stance on that.
Thanks!
July 27, 2011 at 4:32 pm
July 27, 2011 at 4:53 pm
July 27, 2011 at 5:18 pm
July 27, 2011 at 8:04 pm
July 27, 2011 at 6:48 pm
July 27, 2011 at 8:10 pm
July 27, 2011 at 7:18 pm
My question is this though: do you worry about nutrient deficiency since you’re not eating veggies? Veggies do not work well for me either. I’m currently pregnant and eating liver regularly and my body seems to LOVE nettle infusion, both of which my midwife is comfortable with me using to replace a prenatal vitamin (which I cannot tolerate because of the iron content), but I still wonder if I’m getting enough nutrients.
I also notice that if I eat no fruit/starches, I have no cravings. But as soon as I start again, oh man! The cravings get intense!
July 27, 2011 at 8:17 pm
I don’t worry about nutrient deficiencies. I eat lots of special foods like bone broths, shellfish, liver, kidney, and quite a variety of fishes, meats, and fats. When I first started this, I was worried about it but after doing it for so long it’s not so much of a concern. I experience the worst nutrient deficiencies when I eat foods which compromise my digestion.
July 27, 2011 at 10:37 pm
August 7, 2011 at 1:31 pm
July 28, 2011 at 4:37 am
July 30, 2011 at 12:50 am
July 28, 2011 at 5:24 am
July 28, 2011 at 9:24 am
I commend you on your determination for sure. For me cutting out dairy and grains was a huge deal and it has impacted my life pretty significantly. I’ve also read GAPS and found it to be a brilliant book that finally explained my digestion issues.
I’m still having some issues with fatigue and considering that I get 8 hrs sleep I think it could be food related, or possibly hormone related. Now I just have to decide if I want to bite the bullet and pay for a homeopathic dr visit to really find out.
Also I think it is great that you can get by without using a car. I imagine in the winter time you have to drive?
July 28, 2011 at 2:31 pm
I ride my bike up until about January here in Colorado. I actually have a snow tire so sometimes I’ll ride in snowstorms. My boyfriend has a car though so when we need it, it’s there, and when we want to go on trips, it’s there. We’re responsible driver; we only drive when we need to.
July 28, 2011 at 10:01 am
I too was eager to see what your diet looked like, when I first saw that you didn’t eat nuts or vegetables. While I have always loved my veggies, I find that I am often left bloated, have heartburn and don’t have that great energy you expect to have from eating such colourful foods. It was a puzzle, and if you have any articles or books that were helpful to you, please post them. In the meantime, I have just naturally gravitated towards a more canivorous primal diet, With fat being my main staple, followed by meat, offal, and some veggies. I rarely eat fruit, though I have no problem with most of them (bananas and pineapple are a no go for me) I just don’t like too many sweet things. I eat a lot of pemmican, now that I know how to make it
July 28, 2011 at 3:07 pm
July 28, 2011 at 12:58 pm
I do not have many issues anymore. My weight and health are in check (started with Atkins and now I am mostly Paleo/Primal except for a thing here and there [real beer, not the mass produced crap]). I have no issues with “will power” as I’ve learned to be responsible for my actions (meaning, I learned that I could not blame anyone but myself for what went into my mouth).
Thank you for this!
July 28, 2011 at 3:10 pm
July 28, 2011 at 4:44 pm
Will power is a state of mind. No?
But you are an inspiration to many by how you are searching for what works for you, regardless of what popular fads are in fashion at the time. Thank you for being honest.
July 28, 2011 at 6:14 pm
One question: can you eat plain Greek yogurt?
July 29, 2011 at 12:23 pm
July 29, 2011 at 2:30 am
I’m eating a ton of raw goat milk kefir, butter and raw goat cheese now, it goes pretty good i think, i want to experiment soon with adding some grasfed beef and fish and leaving the dairy out… see if i feel anything different! Greetz!!
July 29, 2011 at 2:30 am
I’m eating a ton of raw goat milk kefir, butter and raw goat cheese now, it goes pretty good i think, i want to experiment soon with adding some grasfed beef and fish and leaving the dairy out… see if i feel anything different! Greetz!!
July 29, 2011 at 12:21 pm
July 29, 2011 at 2:43 pm
Im 21 and used to be depressed. Ive become better but I still dont feel as good as I hope to become. I sometimes feel strong anguish and sadness. Sometimes even thoughts about suicide if something goes wrong. But those are just thoughts these days, not wishes.
My question is if you think becoming less emotional by eating certain foods would help?
I too feel bad if I eat fruit or nuts and other natural healthy stuff. Im sensitive to many things.
Thanks for a great blog. Take care!
July 29, 2011 at 8:46 pm
July 30, 2011 at 12:39 am
But yes, I agree with the above comments – another great post! I’m so glad I’m not alone in my carnivory… Do get a lot of questions about my bowels though, which I think might be a tad invasive.
July 30, 2011 at 8:47 am
I have gone into my doc’s office in the same way. “Can’t you please help me eat other foods!?” So far, she can’t…
July 30, 2011 at 1:58 am
I’m the spanish girl with acne and PCOS who commented a couple of weeks ago. After reading your post I decided to try a zero carb diet combined with intermittent fasting, in order to try to clear my skin and feel better. And well, two weeks after starting the diet I am ALMOST CLEAR. So, so unbelievable. You don’t know how big is that for me. I had been trying with paleo diet for A YEAR with little or no improvement in my skin condition.
You know, I had always read these stories about people getting magically clear one way or another, and for me It just wasn’t happening. I was asking so desperately for my little miracle… and two weeks ago, I stumbled upon your post through Mark’s Daily Apple, I read it and I just thought “everything is going to be fine”.
At the moment I’m having no troubles with ZC diet. Not constipation at all (fat is great for that) and not insomnia, although I do need less sleep. My mood is so great, I’m completely free of anxiety and cravings and I’m just peaceful and happy. I’m also trying to exercise, have a lot of sun and enjoy life.
I’m eating lots of pastured eggs, liver, seafood, meat and fish. I’m also eating raw cheese, heavy cream, organic butter and some yogurts (but only the cheese is raw, I’m afraid). I’m supplementing with magnesium, vit C and cold liver oil, and planning to get a good multi. I don’t know if I will continue eating this way my whole life, since I do miss veggies and I think I will try to include them again when I get clear. But, as you said, I want to be healthy and I will change my diet and lifestyle until I get it. No matter what is needed to be done, I’m going to do it.
I hope things will continue this way, and I just wanted to THANK YOU so much. I don’t know if I would have tried ZC if I hadn’t read your post, but I do know it arrived in a moment of my life that I was so hopeless and desperate, and so needed for my miracle. Acne has been my curse since I was 12, and I’m 26 now.
You will never know how thankful I am. I really have no words. Keep on being so brave and doing things your very own way. You are truly amazing.
July 30, 2011 at 3:05 pm
I spent the same number of years trying everything, every supplement, every diet, every holistic and conventional approach – nothing.
I was so hopeful when I started the Paleo diet. I read Loren Cordain’s paper about the absence of acne in uncivilized peoples and it made so much sense. I totally quit processed foods and it didn’t make a damn bit of difference. I kind of gave up on the acne – thinking I was plagued to be different – but I couldn’t give up on the digestion. Bad digestion is distracting and noisy and itchy and irritating. It was through the desire to not notice my belly that I was blessed with clear skin. (By the way, there is a connection to digestion and acne but it is not bi-conditional. If I have acne, my digestion is undoubtedly messed up, but if my digestion is messed up, I may not necessarily have acne. Processed meats mess up my digestion but they do not cause me acne. Peanuts majorly mess up my digestion but also do not affect my skin terribly. Just had to throw that out there.)
Please keep me posted, Marina.
August 1, 2011 at 2:08 pm
I’m in my 30s now, and have started to wonder how I will ever have children, if I have to be on birth control pills my entire life. A few years ago I went off the pill to see if my hormones had adjusted, but it resulted in a rapid return of the acne and a course of Accutane. The scarring was just as bad as when I was a teen.
Peggy’s recent posts have been so helpful, and although I haven’t yet gone zero carb (I’ve had to teach myself how to cook and eat meat, so I’m working toward this goal), I’ve noticed a definite difference in mood and energy levels on days when I can keep my carb intake below 40-50 g. I’m hoping within the next few weeks to convince myself to try organ meats, so that I will feel more comfortable switching to a zero-carb diet…who knows for how long…and possibly even go off the pill again.
Thank you, Peggy, for all of this information! I’ll always have more questions, but you’ve answered so many. I really appreciate your sharing this with us.
August 2, 2011 at 4:21 pm
August 2, 2011 at 11:15 pm
August 7, 2011 at 2:52 pm
August 8, 2011 at 2:23 pm
August 17, 2011 at 10:58 am
I’m very interested in the details, as I think we’ve had a similar history with acne. If you’re not comfortable discussing further in the comments or forum, perhaps we can swap email addresses somehow?
August 17, 2011 at 11:14 am
If you’d like to swap emails, let me know and I’ll email you guys the other’s email addresses. (mouthful)
July 30, 2011 at 5:31 am
I know this was TV, but it’s worth looking up to see if this “phytate intolerance” really exists. If it does, then you know you have company–it probably has a genetic base.
A totally true fact to dwell on: traditional Eskimos get very little vegetation or grain in their diet, and mainly live on seal blubber, seal meat, fish, and whatever else they can get meat-wise…nothing grows in the ice caps!
Could you be part Eskimo?
July 30, 2011 at 5:39 am
“PHYTATE INTOLERANCE – The liver’s inability to digest phytate (a phosphorus-containing compound sometimes referred to as phytic acid) most abundant in the outer hull of cereal grains. The intolerance reduces absorption of zinc, copper, iron and other minerals as well as vitamins.”
The only remedy? Soaking your grains via the WAPF method (Weston A. Price), or just eliminating them altogether. The WAPF method wasn’t working for me, so I just eliminated them myself.
This (above) may be why you feel like crap when you eat certain foods.
July 30, 2011 at 8:43 am
Having been a long time lover of WAPF and Weston Price I know all about soaking of grains and nuts and, of course, I tried that too. No different for me. Maybe these extreme cases of intolerance are beyond soaking though.
Thanks a WHOLE LOT for thinking of me. I have managed to figure out that I can only eat meat, but I sure am vexed by why, even my ND has no clue…
July 30, 2011 at 3:44 pm
July 31, 2011 at 10:07 am
August 1, 2011 at 4:42 pm
August 2, 2011 at 4:18 pm
July 30, 2011 at 6:26 pm
That’s really interesting about the apathy thing. I’m a highly emotional person. When I was in college I went on Prozac for two years to get me through to my degree. I hated that it stunted my emotions. Even though it prevented depression and rage, it also prevented me from feeling excitement and elation. But being “Vulcan” would be much easier than being a mental or physical wreck, for sure. Luckily, I’m getting less negatively emotional as I eat better.
Obviously, you’re eating the best diet for you, but I’m really curious about how meat-heavy diets affect longevity. I’ve read a few articles on this, but was wondering if you knew of anything helpful on the topic.
By the way, I am so amazed that you were able to eat only soured dairy for six months. Talk about determination. I don’t think I could handle that kind of restriction.
July 31, 2011 at 9:40 am
I have read a few studies on meat affecting longevity and the ones I’ve read are poorly executed. You have to understand that sooooo many of the studies done today employ terrible statistical methods. For example, check out this widely accepted study about calorie restriction. http://theprimalparent.com/2011/05/29/calorie-restriction-the-quality-of-diet-seems-to-matter/ The methods are non-sense, though, because the test subjects eat a high-carb diet. Likewise, you can’t conclude that eating a lot of meat affects longevity when the meat your using in your study is feed lot, processed meat, alongside a high grain diet. Nobody that I know of has done studies on real people that eat a variety of healthy meats and seafood and organs.
But even if meat did have some affect on longevity, I couldn’t care less about it. I am only interested in the quality of life, not how long I live. It doesn’t make any difference to me if I die tomorrow as long as the days I do live are great ones.
July 31, 2011 at 7:29 pm
Weird about the dairy fat thing. Usually it’s the sugar or protein people can’t handle. I just keep thinking it’s so amazing you have been able to figure out how to feed yourself because it’s so different from the norm.
August 2, 2011 at 3:10 pm
August 2, 2011 at 5:32 pm
July 31, 2011 at 2:29 pm
July 31, 2011 at 8:01 pm
August 2, 2011 at 4:14 pm
August 2, 2011 at 7:06 pm
I have no idea what foods disagree with me outside of grains, legumes and dairy. I’m not even one hundred percent sure that all foods in those groups cause me harm. Ill be starting an elimination experiment after my camping trip with my siblings. Thus, it starts on Monday, august 8.
Thanks so much for the inspiration Peggy!
August 2, 2011 at 11:30 pm
1) You mentioned that certain foods give you panic attacks. May I ask which ones have you seen a link to (diffinitive or possibly) and if you came to this conclusion purely through the elimination diet? I suffer from heart problems related to panic attacks and have been looking for possible alternative solutions, namely nutrition.
2) How do you know/think you have the fructose malabsorbtion? My 1 yr old gets diarrhea frequently and can be timed to have anything int he berry family (including the non-berry blueberry) go through her within a half hour. I’m trying to figure out if it is fructose. Namely I need the diagnosis so my extended family doesn’t give her anything that upsets her stomach.
3) Do you ever feel restricted in your diet? Or is it restricting to the point of liberation?
4) Any words of encouragement? lol.
Thanks so much for your blog. It is so very helpful to an aspiring Primal Mom.
August 3, 2011 at 10:13 am
1. while I suffered many different mental problems before I changed my diet, panic attacks were never among them. Until, that is, I had a severe brain injury last year. For months I was a very different person and the panic attacks seemed life-threatening. After the accident I was still eating paleo but had added starches and several other things I cannot tolerate. In retrospect, it seems that the panic attacks were due to the TBI in conjunction with starches and allergens.
2. I suspect I have fructose malabsorption because I get a very rumbly gassy stomach each time I eat fruit or honey and almost always get diarrhea too. I also get acne and depression. It was difficult for me to believe this for a long time because fruit is supposed to be detoxifying and healthy. It is also supposed to elevate the mood. Anyway, I’ve done some pretty controlled tests on this with myself and these symptoms are undoubtedly linked to fructose. There is a test for it but I haven’t bothered getting it.
3. Oh yeah, I do feel restricted sometimes. But I find that feeling of restriction is exaggerated after I actually eat the stuff I shouldn’t be eating. But yeah, sometimes I give in. And then I force myself to pull it together again. These phases usually last me a week. Once my digestion has gotten bad and my skin and my mood I get out of it.
4. When I want to eat something out of my ordinary I deliberately think of the consequences I can expect. I ask myself if it’s worth it. 95% of the time I answer no. I have a vivid imagination so I can really put myself there.
August 4, 2011 at 5:39 pm
August 4, 2011 at 7:34 am
I have been having digestive issues for 7 years or so, mostly bloating, and in the past 4 years have been experimenting with WAPF and primal diet stuff. My diet is so clean now (raw dairy kefir, coconut oil, pastured eggs, no grains etc), you would think I should be totally healthy, but there is still something else going on. The reaction to a food seems so random and I read it could be delayed up to 72 hours! I have thought before about trying a raw meat and egg only diet for a while to see how I do, but that seems scary.(don’t I need fiber?!) This post has inspired me to try it though. I was a vegetarian for a while (I know now all that soy protein was hurting me), and I wonder if I could eat that much meat all day. Sometimes just chewing it grosses me out. I don’t like liver, except some liverwurst, and definitely don’t think I could it raw! Did you have any problems with that at first? I do really like ground beef, filet mignon and our pastured eggs, although I have never tried them raw!
I am very tired of trying to figure this out and usually feel like I am the only person dealing with something like this (which I don’t understand when everyone around me is eating fast food SAD), so I am excited that I found your site.
I am looking forward to reading more of your blog, although I am not on my computer much because I am outside playing with my kids!
August 4, 2011 at 1:47 pm
August 4, 2011 at 4:26 pm
August 4, 2011 at 1:48 pm
August 5, 2011 at 10:11 am
Another thing I started doing was putting it in my bone broth (I’m all about condensing as many nutrients as possible into a meal) You can keep it in your broth for the benefits of the nutrients, or, throw the liver in after the broth has been simmering for a few hours, for five minutes. When you take it out, it might be a little pink inside, but that’s just fine. It will have soaked up some of the flavour, and is unbelievably tasty. It’s doesn’t have the mushy gritty texture beef does either. It’s easier here for me to get lamb liver than beef liver, which is just fine because I happen to like it!
August 8, 2011 at 9:04 pm
My husband and I raise our own meat, dairy, and eggs on our little farm. I am much better at raising animals than veg, though I’m no slouch in that dept either.
I’m very hopeful that I’ll be able to get past fibromyalgia symptoms by exploring paleo eating.
August 8, 2011 at 10:51 pm
August 7, 2011 at 8:42 pm
August 8, 2011 at 2:21 pm
My daughter got her dietary calcium from bone broths, canned fish with the bones and skin in, and dark green veggie broth. She also eats a little bit of cheese (like 6 oz every two or three weeks) and occasional yogurt.
I don’t know that calcium deficiency leads to grey teeth. A few things that definitely do, however, are a trauma to the tooth, tetracycline anti-biotic, and too much iron.
August 7, 2011 at 10:25 pm
August 8, 2011 at 3:17 pm
August 8, 2011 at 9:43 pm
you mention your mood being a bit too level without a little bit of sugar. I find that my mood is greatly influenced by the amount of fat i eat. for me, high saturated fat = level mood. do you eat enough fat? i’ve found jackkuses.com pretty good reading regarding this.
and @Gavin… we have essential amino acids, essential fats and now… the essential carbohydrates? explain how one can manage a constant and virtually unwaivering blood glucose level of 4.8mmol/L (can binge on carbs every two weeks and not see a change of more than .3) despite consuming less than 25g of daily carbohydrates per day and lifting weights for hypertrophy (hint, glycolysis is a necessary process, but that does not mean that ingested carbohydrates are)
August 8, 2011 at 10:26 pm
Thanks for taking the time to comment. I am aware that people with gluten sensitivities are also sensitive to casein. I eliminated dairy for years with the assumption that I was not ok with the proteins. I tried butter – still a problem. I tried ghee – no different. (I think I already said something to this effect in another comment above.) And I have not found digestive problems with non-fat dairy so it kind of looks like there’s not a sensitivity there. Dairy fat (and vegetable oils too) makes my digestion very messed up. I don’t want to go into graphic detail here in public (unless people are dying to hear lol) but it was so bad and consistent that I thought I had some sort of bile problem or a bad liver or pancreas that could not process fats. I actually quit eating fat for a while because I just couldn’t process the stuff. But I’m not ignorant enough to go fat free for long so I kept trying to add it back in. Always the same horrible digestive problems, until I discovered tallow. As long as I stay away from dairy fat and veg oils, I’m cool.
My mood is absolutely great. That’s kind of the problem. I am happy and fun loving but just not emotional. I imagine that part of my vulcanness comes from the fact that I used to be so incredibly overly emotional. I’m kind of repulsed at this point by the hightened emotions which ruin people’s lives.
I eat tons of fat – saturated fat. I don’t eat vegetable oils. I eat pemmican and tallow and fatty cuts of meat and eggs. Did you not notice? I don’t eat much carbs so I’d be kind of dying without a lot of fat.
August 8, 2011 at 10:54 pm
August 12, 2011 at 11:36 pm
thanks peggy for your response. i totally identify with what you mean about emotions on a low carb diet. my jibe about fat, however, was not directed at you!
August 13, 2011 at 2:59 am
August 8, 2011 at 5:45 pm
Do/did you have mercury fillings? Did your mother? Have you or your mother ever smoked cigarettes, been near a broken thermometer, a broken flourescent bulb, lived in a house with lead paint, played with lead toys, smoked out of a painted bong or hookah, etc?
I recently had my amalgams removed, began taking many supportive supplements as described by Andy Cutler in his book, and I’m now slowly experimenting with food reintroductions, like milk and broccoli. It’s going extremely well. There is an inexpensive hair sample test you can get for under $100 that can tell you if you have heavy metal issues. If I was standing in front of you, I would plead for you to order Andy Cutler’s book “Amalgam Illness”, have a read, and just see for yourself. You’ve got nothing to lose. The book title is a bit misleading, as it covers any sort of heavy metal toxicity.
August 8, 2011 at 6:49 pm
I have read a couple of books about heavy metal poisoning. Believe me, in all my searching for a cure I read plenty about heavy metal poisoning. And then I had my metals checked. I had no significant metals in my body. It was a big disappointment. I was really hoping to have all my problems solved by something as simple as chelation… Oh well.
August 9, 2011 at 2:18 pm
Some toxic metals get sequestered away and bound up so tight in certain areas of the body that there is no simple way to test for them other than to evaluate your symptoms and then start trying to remove the toxic elements through methods like chelation.
August 9, 2011 at 2:55 pm
Tony,
That’s exactly as I understand it as well. This also applies to blood, urine, and stool tests. Andy Cutler covers this subject as well. Along with the hair test, they provide you with a blood mineral analysis, which can help to diagnose malfunctioning metabolic pathways, which may be malfuntioning due to heavy metals. Andy has written another book on interpreting these results, and the yahoo chelation groups have much experience in this area as well.
Quite frequently, the person’s followup analysis do show the heavy metals after chelation once they are pryed from their hiding places. Symptoms improve concurrently. It’s all very interesting and repeated over and over by newcomers.
August 9, 2011 at 6:17 pm
1. I had undiagnosed celiac disease until I was 26 – my mineral levels got seriously unbalanced and low since childhood.
2. I was a soy consuming vegetarian for 13 years – soy being known to destroy intestines and estrogen levels.
3. I suffered very dramatic and extreme stress which depletes a body of essential nutrients, hormones, and the ability to make neurotransmitters.
4. I was raised on shortening (transfats) and omega-6 oils and rarely ever saw any omega-3s.
Growing up this way, there are many solid reasons why my body turned out the way it did
August 9, 2011 at 3:10 pm
I mean, it wouldn’t surprise me at all if I did…
Here’s the thing, though, I spent soooo many years believing everything I heard about health. I needed to believe at first. I didn’t know any better and I was desperate. I also spent a whole lot of money. I’m extremely skeptical these days and am not as likely as I used to be to read a book and go out and spend a ton of time and money chasing yet another solution that doesn’t apply to me.
August 9, 2011 at 3:35 pm
This is where the mineral analysis comes in. It may show you your mineral levels are completely out of whack with what you thought they were. It may be showing you are not absorbing or are quickly excreting essential minerals, even if you are supposedly ingesting ‘enough’ of them from real food. Thyroid and adrenal tests are also recommended in establishing your baseline.
If you’re not sure it’s worth it to proceed, it’s important to ask yourself the questions I proposed above to try and get an idea of you’ve ever had significant exposures over your entire life, even in the womb. Heave metals are carried to the fetus before the placental wall is developed, and can also be in breastmilk. My mother had a ton of amalgams since childhood, and so have I. I’ve been tourettic, OCD, manic/depressive, you name it. A diet very similar to yours has mitigated much of it, but I think i’m now really getting to the bottom of it.
It’s my opinion that those of us who have to take drastic measures such as salicylate/phenol avoidance to feel and function OK have more going on underneath than simple food allergies. We have enzymatic problems, and why are they screwed up? These are common subjects and symptoms that are addressed and resolved in Cutler’s world. You won’t be any worse off by simply reading his book.
August 8, 2011 at 5:51 pm
August 8, 2011 at 7:17 pm
What is your daughter’s diet like?
I’m currently breastfeeding a 6 month old who has yet to start eating solids (gonna hold off as long as I can! Why mess with a perfect food?). I’m certainly not going to feed her baby cereal, will probably do fruits and other normal baby mush, but my midwife/pediatrician said meats might give her too much protein early on.
I know your daughter is much older than mine, but I’d love to hear your thoughts and experience feeding her.
for me, I love love love dairy. Lots of raw milk mixed with heavy cream (or just a swig of cream when I’m feeling peckish), kefir, cheeses, butter (I eat grass fed butter straight from the block. Yum). I even eliminated all dairy when I thought my daughter might be sensitive for about 6 weeks, missed it terribly, and felt great when I added it back in. Maybe my northern European heritage helps . . . ? Still not sure what I’ll do for daughter with dairy.
Anyway, thanks!
August 8, 2011 at 10:37 pm
She ate things like avocado, raw liver, banana and raw egg yolk, vegetables blended with lots of butter (you could use tallow), raw fish, and home made chicken and beef soups made with bones, coconut oil.
August 8, 2011 at 9:48 pm
August 8, 2011 at 10:33 pm
August 9, 2011 at 1:09 pm
August 9, 2011 at 3:47 pm
You are an inspiration! I look forward to following your blog!
August 11, 2011 at 9:13 pm
August 12, 2011 at 7:57 am
Eating a diet like mine of meats and fats keeps me extremely lean but eating just raw food makes me even leaner (if that’s even possible). There’s a trade off for everything. Eat more and feel sated or eat less and feel like a trillion bucks.
December 16, 2011 at 2:01 pm
December 17, 2011 at 2:45 pm
December 17, 2011 at 7:49 pm
I just tried some raw, and I’m not quite sure if I will be able to stomach it. I haven’t tried the swallow holding my nose method yet, but I will if it’s more nutritious raw.
August 13, 2011 at 5:55 pm
You say you think you may have fructose intolerance. This made me start to question if I may have it too. My only question is, in your diet you show some days when you consume sugar in your yogurt and also in your limeaid. Please correct me if I’m wrong, but I thought sugar(sucrose)is made up of glucose and fructose. Do you have any bad reactions with having sugar? Wouldn’t the sugar cause you problems too if you were fructose intolerant or would it have more to do with the dose so to speak? I am just curious as I only consume fruits and veggies as my source of sugar, but am now wondering if plain old sugar would cause me the same problem. I am now wondering if my problem has more to do with the fiber particularly in the veggies. Would love to get your thoughts on this as I would love to weed out any foods that may be causing my digestive problem. Thank you so much,Peggy!
August 13, 2011 at 6:14 pm
August 14, 2011 at 2:17 pm
August 15, 2011 at 11:07 am
Oysters? I eat them at restaurants often and I get them from whole foods too. I don’t think it really matters which raw foods you eat, just as long as you do eat some. So, oysters are fine.
I buy from US Wellness about once a month these days. I eat pemmican just about every day and they are the only place to get it. (I could make it myself…) Plus, I add their tallow to just about everything I eat. I eat a whole lot of fat, that’s what keeps me kickin. I also like to buy my beef bones from them – soup bones and marrow bones. I buy my steaks and ground beef from a local 100% grass fed and finished farm.
August 18, 2011 at 9:27 pm
Cheers,
Dave
August 18, 2011 at 9:33 pm
August 18, 2011 at 9:47 pm
Cheers,
Dave
August 19, 2011 at 6:36 am
August 23, 2011 at 12:20 pm
I really believe I need to eat carbs tho, so I am following a lowcarb, timed/portioned program…usually lol. Just eating meat with some fibrous veggies would probably be ideal for me!
August 24, 2011 at 8:56 pm
August 25, 2011 at 2:17 am
A couple of links: http://www.kickas.org/londondiet.shtml
http://www.lowstarchdiet.net/index.html
I discovered starches were the issue for me through playing around with my paleo diet, going low carb and then adding “safe starches” back in because of low mood. I was baffled until someone told me about AS and the low starch diet.
August 25, 2011 at 9:45 am
August 25, 2011 at 11:59 am
August 25, 2011 at 4:51 pm
Thanks for your. Awesome post! I have just posted a long question on paleohacks about my digestive issues as I think I have little choice but to give the carnivore thing a go. My post is: http://paleohacks.com/questions/60708/help-food-intolerances-ibs-sibo-do-i-go-zero-carb#axzz1VzrxbpDg
Cheers,
Adam.
August 25, 2011 at 6:45 pm
August 25, 2011 at 10:40 pm
August 26, 2011 at 7:03 am
Paul recommends to have at leat 400 kcal from carbs (100 from rfuit, 300 from starches). I enjoy an occassional sweet potatoe but I find white rice boring and adding it to my diet is something I can do without causing me health issues but I do not enjoy it a lot. As I am an athlete Paul would recommend probably more in my case..I am scared to provoke health issues especially as I found it convincing that vegetables do not count as a carb source as the sugar content is digested by gut bacteria…I still feel I haven`t found my own path nutrition wise…I would love to hear your opinion! It would be also great if you could recommend some sample menues for those who include more vegetables/starch than you do for I like your approach of simplicity but I need more plant stuff! Would you mind sharing how many calories you usually eat and how much (if any) you added when pregnant?
Thank you so much and please keep on blogging!
August 30, 2011 at 8:58 am
September 28, 2011 at 2:46 pm
http://www.gnolls.org/1984/the-science-behind-the-low-carb-flu-and-how-to-regain-your-metabolic-flexibility/comment-page-2/#comment-6@100@2254
-and-
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/?p=1077#comment-31321
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/?p=1077#comment-31349
I hope those links help
August 29, 2011 at 11:19 am
I am curious if you found your ideal diet strictly through trial & error, or if you at any point consulted w/naturopath or nutritionist? Any references you found helpful? I appreciate hearing about your experience.
(Hey, I’d love to be Vulcan too – live long & prosper!)
August 29, 2011 at 2:19 pm
September 2, 2011 at 6:52 pm
I just happened on your site through MDC and I have to say that it is intriguing! The idea of eating raw meat sounds interesting to me, though it is not within our means at the moment, as we cannot afford grassfed beef.
My question is this: when I was in college my A & P professor scoffed at all-meat diets because he claimed that a person would develop fatal ketoacidosis. How does one prevent such a condition from occuring? Have you ever come across someone claiming this? As you can see, I don’t remember all the details about ketoacidosis
Clearly, at least a few pre-industrial cultures ate minimal to no plant matter and remained healthy.
September 2, 2011 at 7:50 pm
Your professor was mistaking ketoacidosis for ketosis – a common but careless confusion. From Wikipedia,
“Ketoacidosis is a pathological metabolic state marked by extreme and uncontrolled ketosis. (Normal ketosis, by contrast, is a functional aspect of fat-based energy metabolism, induced by prolonged fasting or a low-carbohydrate diet.) In ketoacidosis, the body fails to adequately regulate ketone production causing such a severe accumulation of keto acids that the pH of the blood is substantially decreased. In extreme cases ketoacidosis can be fatal.”
Ketoacidosis is a dangerous condition that often happens to people with type 1 diabetes.
September 2, 2011 at 8:45 pm
I wonder what a biologically appropriate diet would be for someone with Type 1 Diabetes, who didn’t produce insulin.
September 3, 2011 at 8:12 pm
September 3, 2011 at 8:24 pm
September 8, 2011 at 9:01 pm
September 10, 2011 at 5:31 pm
Take care!
September 11, 2011 at 7:27 am
September 11, 2011 at 12:28 pm
September 26, 2011 at 1:35 pm
September 28, 2011 at 2:50 pm
http://www.gnolls.org/1984/the-science-behind-the-low-carb-flu-and-how-to-regain-your-metabolic-flexibility/comment-page-2/#comment-6@100@2254
-and-
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/?p=1077#comment-31321
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/?p=1077#comment-31349
I hope those links help
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
September 29, 2011 at 12:05 am
September 30, 2011 at 12:11 am
http://www.archevore.com/
and Paul Jaminet deals with the issue concerning cancer treatment (the idea of deficient glycosation in cancer patients is interesting)
October 4, 2011 at 5:10 am
October 4, 2011 at 11:34 am
December 5, 2011 at 11:56 am
December 20, 2011 at 7:58 pm
I recently found myself full after eating only 1300-1700 cal per day (after switching to MAINLY meats, fats, stock and eggs). Maybe the TYPE of calorie has much more to do with satiety than total amt.
Thanks again, and happy holidays from Boston!
December 21, 2011 at 5:21 am
Happy holidays to you too! One of my brothers used to live in Boston.
December 21, 2011 at 9:27 am
Since going primal though, I make my own lard and tallow, butter and eggs almost daily, making coconut milk a few times a year, along with batches of sauerkraut.. and feet nd old bones for my weekly stocks! Odd transformation
Technically I’ve eaten raw pork before in Germany when I lived there, but topped in with salt and onion and served on a roll.
All the best!
December 17, 2011 at 8:04 pm
December 17, 2011 at 8:09 pm
December 21, 2011 at 5:52 am
You mentioned herbs/spices in your raw meat post. Can you elaborate a little more on which ones you can tolerate? And does it make a difference if they are dried as opposed to fresh?
I have such a hard time with plant matter, and often I think I am reacting to even small amounts of herbs and spices (bloating, cravings, burping…oh the list is endless it feels!.
But it is so hard to know for sure. Sometimes a bit of parsley or chilli or cilantro or mint ‘seems’ to be okay but then other times I seem to get horrid bloat and distress and they seem to sit in my gut for enormous lengths of time. At least it feels like they do because I have yucky buprs where I can still ‘taste’ them 10-12 hours later!!
Vegetables are a nightmare for me, I’ve had no ‘testing’ done but can’t find any so far that don’t wreak havoc on my body and my mind. Fruit is easier, it seems, for me to digest and I ‘could’ eat it if the only factor to consider were GI response, but it leads to other physical issues plus massive cravings, brain fog and mood disturbances which then cause horrid bingeing, so that’s out too.
Anyway, I won’t go on about my long and miserable history with plants, but it does ease the heart and loose the tongue when you find others who understand the same suffering! Thank you for the time and effort you have put into making this info available for others.
December 21, 2011 at 6:33 am
I feel you. Spices do the same to me. If I eat bacon or sausage made with spices (which is most of them), I will burp spices all day. It’s so lame. This is the case with pretty much everything that grows in the ground. Most herbs are also bad for me. My daughter is the one who is such a lover of herbs. I use them occasionally but most of the time not. Parsley is the best herb for me in small amounts. I don’t really care about herbs and spices anymore. I’ve gotten used to life without them. I too like hearing comments from others who can’t tolerate vegetables. When I first figured it out, I thought I was the only one on earth like me. It was kind of scary. Thanks for commenting.
January 3, 2012 at 1:18 pm
my confusion is this…was there a time evolutionarily when all we ate was raw meat and butter and dairy and no vegetables or fruits? i thought our main diet, pre-agriculture, included plenty of plant matter…well, more plant matter the closer to teh equator, more animal foods the closer to the poles.
anyhoo, very curious. as a human with a brain. and as a human who has health issues.
much appreciation everyone for your willingness to experiment and make change.
lynn
January 7, 2012 at 8:01 am
January 7, 2012 at 3:34 pm
I’m doing a meat only trial for a few weeks (previously on GAPS intro for a few months) to see if I can’t get some of my digestive issues under control. Honestly, I’m hoping I don’t have to maintain meat only long term, but I’ll do pretty much anything to feel better at this point : ) I’ll probably never go back to grains though. I’m only on my second day…definitely feel pretty crappy but that expected.
January 11, 2012 at 6:44 am
January 11, 2012 at 8:55 am
January 27, 2012 at 6:10 am
I was wondering if you would address the issues of primal living, the Vulcan state of mind and Art. As a musician and a Vulcan how do the two poles work together in your life? Does being a Vulcan remove the emotion from your art?
My experience is as follows: I’m a filmmaker. Film is an art form whose closest sibling is music. As filmmakers/musicians we must know the difference between a wink and a blink, be aware and anticipate a beat, a colour or a composition. But more specifically, artists must know about the emotion called desire. Desire is film’s stock and trade, it is the main theme for all great films. In fact until the advent of abstract expressionism almost all great art was about desire…and I must report my own personal desire is currently having a dirt nap.
My primal lifestyle is as hardcore as it comes, for the past four years I have eaten nothing but bison, elk, (mostly raw…like tartare) sockeye salmon, low or no glycemic veggies, kimchee and my own mix of supplements. I also do 5×5’s four times a week and sprints twice a week. I went from a rotund 196 to a Spiderman like (the comic not the movie) 155. Waist from 36/37 to 27 (it’s hard to buy jeans now because I also have 36 inch legs). In short, I look and feel fantastic. The flip side to this lifestyle is my desire, empathy and emotion is like my carb intake…like near zero.
My strength as a filmmaker came from my ability to identify a emotion, no matter how small, amplify it and pay it like a violin. I used to get emotional over the most trite matters…tempests in a teacup. Those days are gone. These days I walk though people like a lion meandering through a field of three legged antelope. People look up to me these days. However, the other side of this situation is now I’m looking down at them. This is disastrous for a person in my field. I can still function in my profession because I have a good handle on my craft…I define craft as grab bag of tricks an artist uses to get through various situations. But, craft is no substitute for inspiration, desire or empathy. These days my work seems like a mechanical construct and that’s Ok, but I’m astute enough to see an essential missing element…an element I no longer possess.
In my primal mind emotional meanings have changed for me. Empathy at one moment long ago felt like compassion, now it gives off the foul stench of weakness and desire has changed from the urge to strive to a faint echo of the perverse. I’ve believe I have become a self-contained system in a world full of emotional vampires. As you can imagine, I’m not interacting well with my arts community. Truly, I feel like a Vulcan from the constellation Rigel Five, placed here on earth to observe and report. The same holds true for sex, the emotion and the heightened desire is gone, it has become a pleasant bodily function. I’m not the rational sexual Vulcan that St Augustine envisioned Adam in the Garden of Eden to be…but I’m close.
It seems to me we can play our bodies through the food we eat the same way we can play or choose a musical instrument. And with every choice comes a tradeoff. In my case the tradeoff is health or art.
I’m seriously mulling over the kabbalahic contention that wheat not the apple was the forbidden substance in the Garden of Eden in that it removed humans from state of immortality but gave them knowledge of good and evil…and I’m reaching here…emotional art.
As an aside I can see how primal or “barbaric” peoples were so hard to conquer.
Will I give up my primal lifestyle for art? Absolutely not. But I’m curious how other artists have coped and created art with a reduced emotional palette. Maybe, it’s time for me to drop this art form and move on, there are a lot of things to do in this life…I’m not married to directing. Anyway, I’m looking forward to your response Peggy.
Best,
P.S I just checked out your music. I’m betting the Primal life has impacted your style…Hey, maybe we should create or formulate a Primal aesthetic.
January 27, 2012 at 7:42 am
But all of this ties into what I’m calling the spiritual aspect of Primal…I feel eating this way has completely eliminated my ego chatter. I feel very “one with universe” and see our true nature. Which makes everything we do seem somewhat useless. I’m choosing to take that feeling and go with “if everything is useless, I’m open to doing anything that feeds my soul”.
Anyway, that my contribution…I’m going to be thinking about this from now on. Really, really interesting!
January 27, 2012 at 2:04 pm
January 27, 2012 at 7:04 pm
I hope you don’t mind me chiming in and I say this with much respect, but I hope you don’t give up what you love to do if you in fact really love it. I did the low carb paleo diet for a few years and I just found out this past year that I’m hypoglycemic so I had to stop eating that way. I now eat a pretty high carb whole foods diet and I’m finally seeing the emotional roller coaster completely gone and I now have nothing but a calm state about me. I Just wanted to point that out as I think for a lot of people low sugars can be a major culprit and to many people go undiagnosed because the standard tests for it aren’t catching it.
I know we all have a different way of eating that works for us so I respect how you eat and I respect Peggy so that is why I still frequent her blog. I’m not trying to sound all emotional when I say this, but I would hate for you to give up something that seems to have given you such joy in the past, just for a 27 inch waste and an invincible Spiderman like feeling.
You write so beautifully and you must inspire those around you who look up to you not for your grand stature, but for your true passion for your art. The greatest thing we can do for ourselves is to be true to who we are and do what we love. I know I’m always inspired and in awe when I’m in the presence of someone who is in his/her element and being true to themselves. That’s when we are at our best! Some never truly figure out what makes them tick, but you seem to have and that is definitely more valuable than the food you eat.
What would we be without emotion? I for one never want to be in a world where, for example, the sight of a my baby being born or the passing of a loved one, doesn’t bring a tear to my eye. It is not weakness, but love and my wish for you is that you find what makes you love to the fullest! Then and only then, will you truly be on top of the world. Compassion just means you can relate to others around you, simply because you yourself have lived! Do what makes you feel alive!
Blessing,
Jennifer
February 1, 2012 at 12:55 pm
Thank you so much!
February 1, 2012 at 1:26 pm
February 3, 2012 at 3:18 pm
thanks! kelli
February 13, 2012 at 8:12 am
I’m so impressed that you stick with a diet like this. I try very hard, but end up binging (something I never used to do) on junk that makes me feel like junk. I want to stop so badly…was binging ever an issue for you? Being on such a restricted diet?
Also, whenever I cut out fruit and high starch veg and go ultra low carb (which makes me feel amazing btw) I can’t sleep. Until I eat a banana and then fall asleep like a baby. Do you know why this would be?
February 20, 2012 at 8:15 am
March 9, 2012 at 7:42 am
Thank you so much for this blog and for sharing your experience. You are a truly beautiful person from inside and outside, and a great inspiration for me. I wanted to ask you how long did it take you to get clear of acne, after you started your paleo diet (or better say “Meat only diet”). I have major problem with acne on my face right now and I started a total elimination diet with just grass fed beef, sauerkraut, spinach, green beans, and zucchini+ olive oil and ghee (they seem to be ok for me). i hope to last for 3 or 4 weeks before adding anything if my condition improves. But I know it will be difficult, cause I work and breastfeed (although only a couple times a day) my 21-month old daughter. I would really appreciate if you could share your experience with acne. and also – is it safe to continue breastfeeding with so few carbs? Many thanks in advance, and sorry if this was too long.
March 10, 2012 at 8:31 am
March 15, 2012 at 9:02 pm
p.s. I’m with you on the food at the movies… I don’t find the popcorn there to be remotely palatable
April 2, 2012 at 12:40 am
I am an adoptee who was raised exclusively on formula prior to the introduction of solids. I have a university background in the human sciences, have been researching EXTENSIVELY over the past two years and could literally go on for hours about the problems that formula feeding creates for infants; however, I will choose to address your comment about feeling like a Vulcan when obzerving a primarily meat-based diet. I too have experienced the same phenomenon. In addition I have experienced as a result this style of diet. The thing is when animals are killed (and prior to it due to crowding and other stresses, if they are battery “farmed”) there are a flood of chemicals (adrenaline, etc…) that enter their tissues, essentially poisoning the meat. Ingesting these by-products will certainly affect one’s mind/body. I have to avoid most foods in general as I didn’t get the start (i.e. breast milk) that nature intended. I have, however, had the opportunity to witness calves frolicking and playing like puppies (creeps me out when I think about the meat I have eaten – honestly, not trying to be manipulative). There is a social reality to be witnessed with mowt animals if one looks closely. White rice and green beans (and the odd carrot) are my go-to foods. Dark chocolate and plain potato chips are my recreational foods. I react (and always have) to pretty much anything I ingest as I posses little more than an innate immune system (THEY call it ADHD). If you haven’t already, look into the “Failsafe” diet. It helps those with salicylate/mold/yeast/amine/histamine intolerance. Though if you are also sensitive to wheat/dairy/egg/meat/fish/nut, etc…, things may get a little restrictive. For me the choices are: a.) abandon my diet in the interest of entertaining my palate, or; b.) listen to my body in the hopes of relating to others and not winding up in an alley muttering to myself. Pretty cut and dry, unfortunately. I have learned that the effects build up in my system as time passes and the “bucket” overflows.
April 2, 2012 at 12:45 am
My third sentence should read: In addition I have experienced depression/aggression as a result this style of diet.
P.S. most is a word… mowt is not (too my knowledge)}
April 16, 2012 at 10:30 am
May 25, 2012 at 1:23 pm
July 17, 2012 at 5:40 pm
October 13, 2012 at 10:34 pm
October 15, 2012 at 8:15 am
October 27, 2012 at 4:20 pm
I have to ask before I try this all animal ( no veggie) lifestyle- how are your stools on this diet? Do you have them comfortablely, are they smaller than the average veg. eater, does it only occur every several days…???
I’m sorry but I have to ask b/c that is the reason I want to try this.
I have a History of constipation and spastic colon that i have not resolved. Now i have internal hemorrhoids to show for this problem while using the vegan diet :-/
I’ve been vegan for 20 yrs thinking tweaking within the vegan diet (ive even done 100%raw for 10 yrs) will solve this, it has not so maybe this is the answer?
Any tips I will gladly try them out
November 1, 2012 at 4:27 pm
Have you read the fiber menace? Google it if not and check out his website. He’s probably got the answer to many of your questions. I cannot realistically say what your stools will look like. Our bodies and history is totally different. You should definitely experiment though.
November 1, 2012 at 6:54 pm
I have read it and I don’t remember him ever suggesting no produce, just no suppliment fiber. that is why I was asking your personal experience with this approach. Just so I know what to expect ” in general”
Don’t worry, I’m not asking for visuals (no more pictures of toilets
November 1, 2012 at 8:48 am
Have another question to ask you in addition to the one above. How are you getting all the vitamins and minerals without veg. And fruits? Is this safe longer term?
November 1, 2012 at 4:30 pm